So my engine is having REALLY serious problems... HELP!

scrible88

Went the the river and had a ton of fun the day before yesterday, my 1988 360 ran like a champ the entire time... which is why my Jeep is a "little" muddy... Yesterday it was running a bit odd... occasional off the line slight backfiring and stalling. I thought it could be the plugs so I changed them and it seemed to run better after that.

I go out this morning to start it and it won't start. I crank it in 10 second intervals for about 15 minutes. Finally it starts but sounds really rough, runs for a couple seconds and dies (this motor is usually never cold blooded and will fire right up on a -10 degree day) When it dies I hear a nasty "cracking" like noise and immediately jump out of the Jeep to see what the heck happened. This is what I see:

https://forum.bulltear.com/assets/migrated-images/DSCF0621_c7acce05.jpg

Somehow it managed to spin the oil filter loose (which I know was plenty tight and has been on there for months) within a few seconds it dumped nearly all 5 quarts of the oil onto the concrete. I take the Camry today and decided to deal with it this evening. I get home thinking the oil filter must have in some odd way been really loose although I can't understand how. I go to walmart, get a new filter and 5 quarts of oil... come home and tighten it on with the filter wrench... it stays on but now the engine won't crank. The engine doesn't sound like it normally does when I am turning it over, sounds almost like it isn't turning part of the engine over. With a little gas it will try to start but never will and sometimes backfires gunshot loud while cranking it. It is also spitting some gas out of the carb while turning it over.

Help me guys, timing is set at stock and nothing has been changed, been driving it with this engine exactly how it is for months. Here is a little video clip of it turning over:

http://smg.photobucket.com/albums/v156/sandstormII/?action=view&current=DSCF0626.flv

BREK

Take the distributor cap off and see if the rotor is turning. Sounds to me like the timing is way off ?

scrible88

How could it be way off if I drove it to that spot 8 hours earlier and it was running fine, then it does this stuff.... If the rotor is not spinning would that mean the timing chain or something broke?

Blown7

Sounds like bad things in the timing cover, chain, gears. Going way out on a limb a broken crank. Jeff

scrible88

Rotor turns as usual while cranking the engine

scrible88

Blown7 wrote
Sounds like bad things in the timing cover, chain, gears. Going way out on a limb a broken crank.

Jeff

Why would you say the crank could be broken?

scrible88

bump... anyone! I am really, really needing an answer as this is my daily driver! :shock:

rollen dean montoya

let me see if i can help.gonna ask a few questions and just maybe we can figure this thing out. 1- is there any metal in the pan? check the dipstick.it will show metal if there is any. 2- remove the valve cover and see if all the rocker arms are moving. if not the cam is wasted. 3- if all rocker arms are moving then reset timing to TDC and seeif it will start up. keep us posted

dbesade

BREK wrote
Take the distributor cap off and see if the rotor is turning. Sounds to me like the timing is way off ?

X2.

I know the feeling about having your DD go out.. happened to me a few times. Here is a list-o-stuff I would :

*See if the rotor is spinning.
*See if you have spark (Remember.. Fuel/air + Compression + Spark = Combustion).
*See if you have fuel (read above reasoning)
*You mentioned you were playing near a river: did you go swimming in the rig? Maybe got some water in there?

From the video doesn't sound like the entire rotating assymbly is rotating.. when I heard it.. sorta sounded like an old chebby in which my buddy snapped his crank... so..

Definately keep us posted.

-Dave

scrible88

Rotor is spinning as usual... I never had it underwater although did go through some mud... in all the oil that leaked out there was no water mixed in with it... I know that I have fuel and spark... starting fluid doesn't help anything. I just don't get how I drove it to the spot it sits in then when I go to fire it up the crank snaps, although that could be the nasty noise I heard.

The dipstick doesn't seem to show any metal shavings in the oil.

This is pretty much all I did while out at the river, donuts in the mud and helped a Chevy guy get unstuck...

It boggles my mind that it was running great until I went to try and start it this morning!

111!!!

fuzz401

sounds like it jumped timing to me watch your rotor the 1 cyl valves see if they line up when 1 comes up on the comp stroke

tufcj

My thought is the same as Fuzz. I would say it jumped time. How many miles on it? If over 80K, the plastic teeth on the factory cam gear may be worn/gone and the cam/spark timing is off. As long as the engine is running, there's tension on the timing chain. Once you shut it off the tension releases. When you try to start it, the chain skips over the teeth on the cam gear. I would also check the pressure relief valve on the oil pump. Mine stuck a few years ago and the pressure forced the o-ring out of the oil filter, and it pumped the oil on the ground just like yours. It's the big nut on the back side of the oil filter adapter. Be careful, there's a heavy spring under it. Pull the plunger out and clean with brake cleaner. The added stress of the high oil pressure could have also caused the timing to jump, since the oil pump is driven by the cam/distributor. Bob tufcj

ironman_gq

i had a chain jump on me sounded almost like a valve hit a piston when it happened. pull the timing cover and check your chain and sprockets.

scrible88

I have never dealt with a timing gear/chain/cam before. I know how to get an engine to top dead center though. What will I be looking for if I pull the timing cover to determine if it jumped time?

ironman_gq

look for a broken chain or a very loose chain. If you have a shop manual it will tell you how much slack is normal. also look for broken or worn teeth on the sprockets. to check if the chain skipped, line up the timing marks on the sprockets and follow the directions in the manual. It will usually tell you how many links of chain should be between the marks.

scrible88

I don't have a shop manual, what would you recommend?

BREK

Wouldent you be able to get #1 to tdc and see if the dot's on the gears line up?

AMX69PHATTY

Would doing a compression check first give some indication if the timing chain was ok or not ? When at TDC compression stroke on #1, turn motor further and the #1 exhaust should actuate before crank goes 1/2 turn. The in the next 1/2 turn crank #1 the exhaust should close and the intake should start to open. At 360 degrees crank rotation from #1 TDC on compression stroke both intake and exhaust should both be open a small amount. But with hydraulic lifters which collapse some without oil pressure the valves will not have full travel. Just seems like it would be worth tryin' a couple other things before tearin' apart the front of the motor and timng cover. With the valve covers off, get #1 to TDC compression, then have someone crank it over with the starter and watch the rocker arms for #1 and see if the seem to be in the proper sequence maybe. A compression check would give some indications also wouldn't it ? Das bummer man.

scrible88

Is the rocker arm closest to the front of the engine the intake or the exhaust valve? I don't know which is which. It is terrible weather right now and I will try that when the weather clears up a bit. Everytime it snows/sleets, etc here it seems my Jeep is broken. 111!!!

AMX69PHATTY

On the drivers side the first cylinder in front is #1.
( as u probably know already )
from the front on the drivers side valves / rockers go:
#1 Ex - #1 In - #3 In - #3 Ex -#5 Ex - #5 In - #7 In - #7 Ex
Firing Order is 1-8-4-3-6-5-7-2
Remember it takes 2 complete crank revolutions
to cycle a single cylinder through it's entire operation.
And it takes 2 complete crank revolutions to cycle
all 8 cylinders through thier entire operations also.
So it's funny, because in 1 crank revolution only 4 cylinders fire,
so a V8 is really only using 4 cylinders at a time to drive the vehichle !
:shock: :-| #-o